I was using a Philips Pronto (actually I've had 2 of them over the last 9 years or so).  I got pretty good at programming the things as equipment, favorites, etc. changed. A few months ago the last one took a header off the coffee table and the buttons under the touch screen stopped working.

I bought a Harmony 880. It's OK, but not great.  It's good at turning everything on, setting the inputs, etc. but getting into the functions of each piece of equipment is a real pain.  I can retire the 880 to the master bedroom if I can find something to replace it.

I've looked at the Universal Remote (good name for a company!) products.  They're pricey (from around $450 for their MX-900 to $1,000 for the MX-3000) but they look like they'll do the trick.  The one I think would fit the bill is the MX-980.

Anyone own any of these?  Are they easy to program? The manufacturer doesn't seem all that "end user" friendly; their website makes a lot of references to "your professional installer".  Any help, opinions, etc. would be welcome. So would alternatives.

Thanks!

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Joe
If you can't have fun doing it, it's probably not worth doing.

See if you can download the manual from the website! Regardless of what you do, post what you get and your experience. I have been contemplating one myself. I literally juggle 3 remotes constantly, bringing in an additional 2 or 3 depending what I am doing.

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Scottiemon

Been there, tried that.  They don't have a manual that you can download.  They do let you download the development software but you have to register one of their remotes first.  I did send them an Email asking for information on programming but, so far, no word.  I'll let you know what i find out.

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Joe
If you can't have fun doing it, it's probably not worth doing.

I don't want you to get the wrong idea about the Harmony remotes.  For the price, they're pretty capable. The Harmony 880 sells for about $150 on Amazon, the 890 is $250, and the top of the line 1000 (a touch screen) is $340.

They're easy to set up (you visit a website which downloads codes for your equipment). On the non-touchscreen models, it displays activities on a smallish color screen. The screen shows activities, like "Watch DVD" "Listen to CD", etc. You simply press the button next to that activity and the Harmony turns the right equipment on, sets inputs, and displays common functions on the screen for that device.  Things like numbers, play, fast forward, etc. are assigned to permanent buttons - in that respect it works just like one of your other remotes; the screen would only have whatever special functions for that activity that aren't permanent.

You can get into the equipment functions as well. There's a button you press for devices where you can select the device you want (your AVR for example), you can then scroll through screens of functions.  A warning though, there are 13 screens for my Yamaha RX-V1800.  However, you can re-order the functions.

You can't really program the Harmony but it does replace your other remotes, at least for day-to-day use (I still keep my AVR remote handy).

I have the rechargeable model - and their recharger has gotten bad reviews.  You have to be a bit patient to get it to seat properly; I once got frustrated and placed a book on the remote to keep it in contact.  They do have disposable battery units, but remember, this thing has a color screen; it'll burn the batteries and, in my brother's case, lose the programming (but it's saved on your PC).

Hope this helps. 

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Joe
If you can't have fun doing it, it's probably not worth doing.

joetag,

Concerning your Harmony 880:

I've had the 880 for a year and have been quite pleased with it but your observations are, nonetheless, interesting.  I, too, consider it good at getting into everything and the on-line programming is excellent (IMHO).  However, I've noticed that, as downloaded from Harmony, there are a lot of nested menus/functions that are cumbersome and not logical in their arrangement.  So, a few questions for you.

It's my understanding that, beyond the downloaded pre-sets for any particular piece of equipment, any function/device can be customized and re-arranged to suit the preference of the user.  I was wondering if you've ever attempted to do this and, if you have, does your present level of irritation have to do with this customizability (or lack thereof)?

I've not yet taken the time to try any sort of customizing since I hope to shortly upgrade a14-yr-old AVR and don't want to waste the time on something I'm going to replace (I should probably try this now, however, just to acquaint myself with the process...maybe some rainy weekend).

I looked at the MX-900 but didn't want to spend that much since the Harmony cost me only $150 delivered. Plus, everything I read on the Harmony praised its ease of programming and Harmony's website for constantly adding to the database of equipment, codes, etc.  As I say, for now it's doing everything I want and five other remotes are collecting dust (unless I bring them out for tweaking some particular function).

Your comments would be appreciated.

Fred

Fred,

Yes, the Harmony is customizable and it's not very hard to do.  You can add/remove/change things that show up on the screen. You can even re-order them.  As you know, you can, for example, press a button to "Watch Cable TV" which turns everything on and sets the inputs. You can then customize the first "Watch Cable TV" screen to include whatever remote selections you'd like to have for any piece of equipment the Harmony is controlling. You can even set up additional screens and you'd scroll through them.  The whole process is pretty simple once you figure out where to go in the software.

What it doesn't do it allow you to write macros.  This may or may not be a big deal (you're certainly going to pay for the capabilility).  Let's say when you want to watch cable TV you'd like to turn on the cable box, the AVR, and the TV. Set the AVR to "DTV/CBL", set the TV input to AVR, turn the volume up to X, change the TV to "vivid", and tune in channel 123. You can do all of that with a macro labled "Watch TV".  I had my Pronto programmed so that when I pressed "record" when I was watching TV, it would answer the series of questions that Cox likes to throw at you "one time or every time?" "how long do you want to save it?" "press A to accept". You can even program in delays so the remote doesn't go faster than the equipment can accept it (I found this useful with the cable box).

I think my frustration with the Harmony, if you can even call it that, is something akin to being used to driving a sports car and replacing it with a minivan. Functional, practical, less expensive, but not as much fun to drive. :-)

I"m continuing my quest; I'll let you know if I find anything interesting.

 

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Joe
If you can't have fun doing it, it's probably not worth doing.

joetag,

Appreciate your feedback...very helpful to me.

I can tell from your explanation and reference to macros that your needs/expectations are far more demanding and involved than mine.  While I have a basic understanding of the usefulness of macros, I'm not so sure that it presents much importance to me since I'm an audio guy who just wants to control and adjust (play with?) what I'm listening to...and want to do all of this with a single remote.  Conversely, your needs seem to be more centered on automation, convenience and efficiency.

After I finally select my AVR (looking at Onkyo, Yamaha, Marantz and NAD), I intend to sit down and start re-arranging the selections available on the Harmony.  When I do, I'm going to pop a question on this forum concerning help in getting my 880 programmed....so I hope you'll be listening.

Also, I can totally identify with your "frustration" observation...I'd much rather drive my G35 Coupe than my wife's Accord: while both will get us where we need to go, the G is a lot more fun (and especially when I'm on a twisty road and in my "boy racer" mode)!

Concerning your "frustration with the Harmony, if you can even call it that"...this observation alone leads me to believe the Harmony will more than satisfy my needs.

Thanks for a most informative post.

Fred

You're very welcome Fred; many people here have helped me out.

I will keep an eye out for any question you may have about setting up the 880 with your new equipment. I recently changed my AVR and was surprised how easy it was to swap out my Pioneer with a Yamaha in the remote.

Driving a G35 coupe or an Accord - talk about "no-brainers"!  I had a Nissan 350Z that is pretty much your G35 with no backseat and no trunk.  It was a sweet ride; one word of advice though, never ever get broadsided by a Chevy Avalanche pickup truck. I suppose the good news is that I surived and the only scratch was a small burn from one of the airbags. The Z was totaled, the Avalanche had $3000 in damage. Go figure.

Good luck on your AVR hunt.

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Joe
If you can't have fun doing it, it's probably not worth doing.

I have a Harmony One and so far it's been pretty easy to use.  I like the ability to touch one button and have the remote do all the work.  For watching dvd's it turns on the tv,dvd player and receiver.  I'll give a final opinion on it when I start using it a little more. 

I know I am hopping in a little late here but I do have decent advice that comes from a former home theater installer who was a dealer, at one time, for both Harmony and Universal Remote.

 

Harmony:

Pro's

They are a product that a mortal with no knowledge of remotes can program

They handle toads well. A toad is a Toggle Off And on Device. One power button does both on and off. (Hard to set macros for)

They have good aesthetics, fit and finish is pleasant.

The coveted "Help" button. A favorite of the ladies. When not all devices receive the commands for the remote, like when someone presses a macro button them immediately sets the remote down not giving it a chance to send all commands from the "aimed" position, this button will walk though each step asking you if the device is on and in its correct setting.  

 

Cons:

You will likely spend days on the phone with tech support if you are anal about how your remote works in comparison to the original. ie original remotes one can hold the down button and see the selections scroll by. With Harmony, at least at the time I was a dealer for them, would automatically insert pauses so it was like pressing the button each time a selection changed. If you use your interactive channel guide and are quick at it a Harmony will slow you down.

Harmony was my most warrantied product at almost 75 percent failure rate. They are made by logitech.

If you do not have internet forget about programming your remote.

All the infrared codes out there are owned by one or two companies, Universal remote being one of them Universal Electric (MyNevo) being the other. Harmony rents the ir code database or has such an agreement that will not allow them to give the codes to you in the form of a program you can keep on your computer. Many see this as bad.

 

Universal Remote:

Pro's:

Great tech support. Any early adopters out there can appreciate an efficient support system.

Perfect cloning of your existing remotes meaning that there are no pauses like with harmony. Any Harmony owner who I handed a Universal Remote
wanted one after pressing only a few buttons.

Both Harmony and Universal Remote offer RF expandability allowing one to put equipment behind cabinet doors or even in a different room.

Programming can be tricky www.remotecentral.com is the "installers lounge" for exchanging tips and tricks. With a little knowledge of your cable box and creativity anyone can nail one button press macro's and gain complete system control.

Cons:

 
Universal Remote, like Apple, is concerned with end user experience. They want everyone to experience their remotes to their potential. Thus they observe a closed system of distribution for their software. You need to be a dealer to get the means of programming.

Price. If you are looking at the top level touch screens then yes price is up there. The MX-850 Aeros is a great remote for the power user. Tactile buttons that you can feel will never replace the screen you have to look at in some peoples minds. Volume is hard to play with during a dark movie scene if its a touchscreen based remote.

 

(Breathe) That being said I would be willing to help anyone on the Aperion forums with their programming if they did decide that a Universal Remote was for them. I am not a current dealer but I do have the needed software to program a great deal of their product line. My MX-850 trumps any Harmony have ever used in terms of reliability, usability and responsiveness.

 

Daryl
 

 

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CEDIA certified

Well I finally did something about the remote.  After giving up on Universal Remote (who finally agreed they'd sell me a remote at list price, let me download the software but wouldn't provide any type of support) and reading nothing but negative reviews of the current line of Pronto remotes I got a Harmony One.

Actually, "got one" doesn't come close to what happened.  My Harmony 880 suddenly went a bit "nuts". I needed to pull the battery about once a week to get it to reset itself (it would freeze) and about once every few weeks it would reboot itself for no apparent reason. It also was having trouble holding a charge.  For those of you who have one of these you know the biggest complaint is that it doesn't always sit nicely in the charger; I would put a book on top of the remote to hold it down.  I contacted Logitech to ask about the quirky behavior and asked if there was any suggestion for the charger seating problem. Three hours later I got an email from them apologizing for the problem, then telling me that my unit was out of warranty, then telling me they couldn't fix it anyway and then telling me that they'd give me a 50% discount on any Harmony remote if I called their 800 number to place the order.  That's how I "got one".  If you have an older Harmony you might see if they'll give you the same deal.

My biggest concern with the Harmony One was giving up all the tweaks I added for the 880.  But, the Harmony software has a "replace your remote" function.  All I did was click that and sit back while it transferred everything I did to the new remote. And, it worked!  I only had to change the order of a few things (the Harmony One has a touch screen and because people have fat fingers you can't display as much on the screen as you can with the 880).

Thought I'd share - it still lacks the macro function, but I've learned to live without it.

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Joe
If you can't have fun doing it, it's probably not worth doing.

Good to hear, Joe.  I have a Harmony 720 that they only sell at certain places (bought mine at Costco) and I've generally been quite pleased with it.  It would be perfect for me if it had macros and was RF instead of IR.  I've worked around the lack of macros by adding some "sequences" as additional buttons.  As for RF, it looks like Harmony only sells RF to IR converters for their higher end remotes.

-Nick

Nick,

I also have a 600-something that we use in the MBR.  It's OK (we have a TV and a Sony receiver/DVD player/tuner) in there.  My only problem with that one is that it's not rechargeable and it eats batteries.  Long term it might have been cheaper to buy a rechargeable unit. I'm considering buying a new battery for the 880 ($30) and putting it in the MBR but that may not fix the quirky problems and I'd still have to deal with the issue of it not wanting to sit properly in the recharging cradle.  BTW, they have more than fixed that problem with the Harmony One.

I love gadgets like that.  In a former life I used to write computer applications so I actually enjoy writing macros, etc (you should see me with Excel!).  I'm just a bit miffed that Universal Remote is so restrictive because they seem to have a nice product line.

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Joe
If you can't have fun doing it, it's probably not worth doing.

joetag:

I've looked at the Universal Remote (good name for a company!) products.  They're pricey (from around $450 for their MX-900 to $1,000 for the MX-3000) but they look like they'll do the trick.  The one I think would fit the bill is the MX-980.

Anyone own any of these?  Are they easy to program? The manufacturer doesn't seem all that "end user" friendly; their website makes a lot of references to "your professional installer".  Any help, opinions, etc. would be welcome. So would alternatives.

Hi Joe,

I have a URC MX-700, a predecessor to the ones you mention. I've had it for about four years, with no problems with the hardware.

The first thing that I will note is that the company is very end-user unfriendly. In my mind they absolutely hate the end user and don't want to be bothered by us. The only support you'll get is from your "authorized dealer," so make sure you find one who will give you the programming software (with automatic IR database updating) and updates, forever, who you trust. The AVS Forum has several listings of good dealers.

I, of course, bought mine from Amazon which is one of my favorite retailers since I first used them in 1997. They really didn't like that, but after many attempts and effort, they did provide me with the auto-updating MX-700 programming software. The database isn't updated very frequently, but that's fine as it is a learning remote and I don't update my gear that frequently either.

I love the MX-700. I really dislike working with the manufacturer. That is why I still use it and have never bought any of their other products; I just plain don't trust them. I like watching their new product releases and saying to myself "yet another URC product I cannot bring myself to purchase," just like I don't purchase any DRM-ridden software or media. It's just not worth the hassle.

Regarding the Harmony: I had one I got some time after the URC in order to try to replace the URC due to my distaste for their customer service. There is absolutely no candle. I could not stand the Harmony. I hated the "stateful" nature of the device, and I didn't like how it pretty much forced you into working the way it wants you to use it. The URC is great; you can program it to work just like the Harmony (with the exception of statefulness, although I understand the 900 series has statefulness) if you want, which I didn't. I have every button that I use regularly put on the 10 LCD screen buttons (actually there end up being only 8 on my "main" page), and every button that I use infrequently on other pages. I can cross devices at my leisure, make macros to turn on a few things and select modes, etc. I think the URC is a much better product for who I am (a control freak hands-on software engineer, probably). 

Cheers!

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Speakers: Aperion 6T, 5DB, 6C, 12D
Receiver: Denon AVR-3808ci
Monitor: Panasonic TH-65PZ750U
DVD: Denon DVD-1920
Blu-ray: Playstation 3

Harmony One remote.  Have used for awhile now.  No problems very easy setup and use.  Recommended to a friend and he also enjoys it.

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24 hours in a day ... 24 beers in a case ... coincidence?