Dan seems like a nice guy so I won't be offended by, "I'm just an average Joe " in his post. I'm sure I speak for JoeZ as well. :-)

 

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Joe
If you can't have fun doing it, it's probably not worth doing.

dmgoodman:

If you are considering a 5 channel amp take a look at the Emotiva XPA-5.  200 watts per channel and the best bang for the buck at $799.00 unless you go used. People are raving about that amp.

Before you go that route, check the volume settings for each channel in your receiver's set-up.  On my Onkyo I can change each channel from -12db to +12 db. Probably something similar on your unit.

I wasn't happy with the volume on an Onkyo 702 receiver that used to in my main system until I realized the individual channel volume levels were set too low.   I was disappointed at first in that receiver until I modified those settings. 

I think that may be what Jack is saying as well - he helped me with a related issue a few weeks ago on my 805, too.  Audyssee had set the volume levels too low. I was incorrectly concerned about the 805's ability to drive the 6B's.

Maybe you have considered this already but its worth taking a look.

 

Mike 

 

 

 

This is interesting.  i think I know what you are talking about.  These are the seperate levels you adjust for each channel when calibrating to your SPL meter, no?  I started my calibration with everything set to "0".  I think my center channel is at -4DB's now and my rears are around -2db.  Basically I calibrated everything at 75DB to match my mains which are currently set to zero. 

Are you sugessting that I bump my mains up to +10 or so and then calibrate the rest of my system at 75DB's?

Joetag and JoeZ

Oh...thanks for catching that.  Obviously there was not corelation between my remark and your user ID...Anyone who owns an Aperion speaker is well beyone an Average Joe.

For those of you that may be interested I am inserting the SPL vs. Power Chart into this post.

 

Some may have missed the link I gave in an earlier post so I thought I would make it a bit easier to view. I think it gives a good presentation of how much power is needed to attain the same SPL with different sensitivity rated speakers.

 

Jack

Yes, I am suggesting you bump them up.  Worth a shot to see if it makes a difference.  It did for me.

If your mains are now at zero, bump them to +10 and then adjust your center to +6 and your rears to +8 to keep the relative settings the same.  You can fine tune from there.

 

Nice Jack! I can see that the average 100 WPC receiver barely gets those low sensitivity speakers to 100Db's.  During movies I'm assuming you gonna have some problems when the action gets going.  The more sensitive speaker will get up to 115 DB's...

Does the lowered sensitivity on the new line have any performance advantages?  Sort of like less sensitive gives it the ability to take more power and get louder without distortion?

Dan,

 

I am including a link to a chart since this time I cannot copy and paste it into a post. Transients, short bursts and explosions in movies can cause clipping if you are already running close to max volume.

 

Some amps may be able to handle a 10db increase in SPL. You want to avoid clipping for that can damage the speakers since there is a DC component when clipping occurs.

 

Here is the link to the chart.

 

http://home.new.rr.com/trumpetb/audio/dBexamp.html

 

If you are contemplating the 6B’s in the future they are 82db where your 5B’s are 84. 2db may not sound like much but for every 3db in SPL output you need to double the power.

 

The chart corroborates the graph but gives some other interesting details.

 

You will have to ask Aperion if the lower sensitivity speakers are better and why. I don’t have any of the new line so I cant tell you.

 

I did manage to mention the 5B’s in this 5B thread.

 

Jack

Dan,

 

I would try what Mike suggested.

 

After you bump the channel levels, see if you can still get to +16.5 volume on the Yamaha.

 

I found with my 805 that any channel level bumped in the + direction reduced the max volume of the 805 by the same amount. If I raised only the rears to +3 it decreased max volume from +18 down to +15. Your Yamaha may react differently.

 

I found this out kind of by accident. I boosted the rears by 3db. A few days later I found I could only get to +15db. I did this when the input source from the TV was turned way down and thought I just lost 3db. I had to go back and figure out what the heck I did.

 

Jackson

You are correct, Jack, the Onkyo will reduce the max volume when you adjust the individual channels upward. Don't know about the Yamaha but I imagine it would, too.

Partly its the "psycho-acoustic" effect.  I felt better when it put out more volume at a lower setting on the volume dial! 

How loud is loud?  When I get into the 100 db range that's about all I can take.  That's at about 70% of max volume on my 805 driving the 6B's.  I haven't
taken it much beyond that to keep the amp and speakers safe, to protect my ears and to protect delicate items in the room!  Its shaking pretty good in there by then.

 

Onkyo 805+Aperions....

Good times gentlemen, ah yes. Good Times!

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Scottiemon

Hi Mike,

I just wanted to be sure I had the headroom and that is why I set my most insensitive speaker to 0 db and the rest in the minus direction if needed. I think I have a really good balance with various sound fields from the 805.

I don’t mind turning the 805 up to +5 for movies since I know there is more there to give.

All my 10 Aperion’s are within 0 or minus 4db. My 532-C center is at –4db. I don’t like a lot of center. Some here say you really need a great center; I would rather have great fronts. For some reason I can still hear dialogue with ease.

The final word is that if you are pleased with the sound just go with your own perception.

We all see things a bit different so what works for me may not work well for you. Trust your ears and you be the judge. Experiment and then do it again and if you are ambitious just do it one more time.

I found that when you try a few things and experiment a bit you could then begin to help others.

Jack,

I am one of the three “805” Amigos.

Honestly..Why mess with a piddly 90wpc receiver when I can have a massive 300 WPC x 5 amp...I'm sure with 300 WPC I'd be able to drive the Aperions.....

Becuase I can't afford it that's why...

To be honest my stuff sounds awesome with the Yamaha.  There are times however that I wish I could turn the volume up a little bit more when watching movies...

Jack is right about increasing individual speaker output levels, via your receivers set up menu. This is done strictly for calibration purposes. It will in no way increase the output level of any receiver, on the planet. The most cost  efficient way to increase the output of your receiver is to invest in speakers with a medium to high sensitivity rating. Most audiophiles agree that any speaker with a sensitivity below 87 db. is hard to drive. The 632 LR from the old line had a sensitivity of 86 db.. The new 6B speaker has a sensitivity of 82 db. The 632LR driven by 100 watts would  play louder than a 6B driven by 200 watts, at the same given volume level. For every three db's lower in sensitivity a speaker is, the wattage must be doubled to  produce the same volume level.

Mr. jrhooper,

 

I consider you to be knowledgeable in the realm of electronics. I can tell by your post.

 

I have been on this forum for over a year and it is sometimes difficult for those to fully understand what I am trying to say.

 

I may speak too technically which shuts people down.

 

If one does not present facts versus fiction then how can one decide?

 

I prefer fact over fiction.

 

Thanks jrhooper.

 

Jackson

Is this why I am basically ignored when I post?  My B.S. is only in Physics and not in home consumer electronics..  Am I allowed to play here too?